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charlie

Some great thoughts there, very amusing to hear from your point of view.
You see over here (and i may upset a few people now by being a snob) but flag flying (as in hanging from your house window, car etc) is seen as a somewhat yobbish behaviour. Mainly due to the world cup/ association with footie fighting lads and the BNP. Where it is often used in aggression to intimidate.

I live with one of the most patriotic people i've ever met who is constantly cross at the apathy of most brits.

True patriotism runs much deeper than an iconic flag. I believe it's about pride in your past, present and future. Where England lost that is for the history buffs to debate.
Sorry ended up ranting!

Kath

No apologizing - I like to hear what my "over the sea" readers think!

I've heard that people think it's yobbish as you say - and I most certainly understand about the football & BNP connection, but that's what I think is so sad. How it ever became so linked with those I'll never understand (add it to the list of things!)

I fully agree with you that true patriotism is much more than a symbol. You can never forget what you stand for, and that's what our flag means to us. It's not about power, or intimidation to us, (though I know you didn't say that, I'm just thinking out loud) it's about love and freedom. Our love of our country and our freedom, and what it took to get here. We can never forget that, so we don't!

My future hubby and his family are very much upset with their fellow Brits as well, and constantly praise America (even when we first met) for our love of country and love and support of our military, and its allies.

BB

To add a further confusing twist to things.
Much of Scotland, particularly the Glasgow area, is affected by a strain of the same kind of Catholic/Protestant sectarianism that is seen in Northern Ireland.
In this context, the British flag is seen as a Loyalist (protestant) symbol and rejected by a significant percentage of the Catholic population, many of whome would rather fly the flag of a whole other country - Eire.
This all crystallises round the Glasgow football teams Rangers and Celtic and results in stupid levels of violence on match days.

charlie

Very true of scotland/NI i'd never thought about it like that.
From what you say the american flag does resemble more of a united country which the union jack has not embraced.

At school we were actually taught very little history past 1066 for the UK, (i don't know what the NC is now) but perhaps there would be more patriotism/pride if there was a better understanding of the history of the country as a whole.
From meeting american's they seem to have a better grasp of thier own countries development than brits.

Kath

BB: I had read something about that, I remember thinking "wow." It's all very complicated to me, but I do try to keep up. I know I've written that I'm a little worried about moving over there -- not so much anymore. I'm just going to have to try very hard to keep my mouth shut and my ears open!

Charlie: I think you hit the nail on the head - education is key. I don't actually remember even learning anything past WWI in school - the rest I've had to learn on my own (though it helps having lived with a military history genius). I think that's the other key, somehow through that education, people have to actually CARE about what's going on in the world - which all goes back to the apathy of many in both our countries.

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